""Perhaps the scotsman could explain how not allowing religious imagery in a secular classroom is discrimination"" Italy is a christian country - has been for many centuries. But now in the 21st century christianity can only be practised in private - is this what its coming to? Other countries are not christian - do they face the same restrictions in this matter - no they dont. "How is neutrality discrimination" How is preventing someone from displaying a cross in a public school (most pupils will be christian) neutral? It is the most basic of christian symbols I would guess that most in christian Italy quite like seeing it in public. Also - the cross is about Italians cultural identity - not just a religious identity. This case seems to cater to the minority - which is my main issue with this. The court seems to have taken this womans opinions and elevated them higher than anyone elses. Is this fair? "The victim mentality of christians is nauseating" This has nothing to do with being christian - it is about religious freedom. ALL religions. Why can't Italians live in there own country the way they want. What motivated a mother to go to court for 8 years on this subject - is it that big a deal. Why should her opinion carry so much weight? Where does it end - are churches offensive to atheists. Is Islamic traditional dress offensive to christians - a never ending stream of court cases could be on the horizon. I just think kids face bigger problems in school than 2 bits of wood stuck together.
The Scotsman
JoinedPosts by The Scotsman
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33
European Court: No Crucifixes in Italian Schools
by behemot inhttp://www.nytimes.com/aponline/2009/11/03/world/ap-eu-italy-religious-symbols.html?_r=1.
your opinion?.
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European Court: No Crucifixes in Italian Schools
by behemot inhttp://www.nytimes.com/aponline/2009/11/03/world/ap-eu-italy-religious-symbols.html?_r=1.
your opinion?.
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The Scotsman
" the court ordered Italy to pay a euro5,000 ($7,390) fine to a mother in northern Italy who fought for eight years to have crucifixes removed from her children's public school classrooms""" I cannot understand what her problem is that it deserved an "8 year" legal battle! Apparently the court said that the cross could be offensive to non christians and atheists. Next christmas trees will be illegal! The woman who took the school to court was qouted - "The crucifix creates discrimination" The incredible contradiction here is blatant - this court case creates discrimination. Italian christians are being discriminated against because the cross "might" offend someone - what a joke. I just think this is the gradual errosion of religious freedoms. Here in the UK a similar stealth attack on basic freedoms is occuring. Christmas lights are now called "winter" lights! Merry Christams is becoming "Happy holidays"! I hope the appeal throws this out of court. The world has gone mad......
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Is it disrespectful to call GOD by his name JEHOVAH?
by foolsparadise ini have been thinking about this alot recently.
calling our god the creator by his first name jehovah takes alot of nerve.
my 10 year oll son doesnt walk around calling me by my first name.
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The Scotsman
I would like to think that the creator of the entire universe would not mind if we called him Jehovah. If he did mind - it would be an example of someone who is very easily annoyed.
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*Everyone Please Enter, I'm New Here*
by tryingtoexit ini've been lurking in the shadows of this forum for about 6 months or so.
i'll try to be brief here, but i apologize in advance if this is not "brief enough" for you.
anyways i'm a 27 year old african american young man, i was born and raised a jehovah's witness.
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The Scotsman
Tryingtoexit Welcome to the board - you will receive much support here. Its looks to me you are doing things right - you have done your research and started dealing with facts. I was an elder and resigned October 2007, last meeting was February 2008. I did months of detailed research just like yourself - the meetings became unbearable - I just wanted to scream at the top of my voice. When I told my wife I was leaving she was heartbroken. The good news? When she saw the evidence she left as well - Woo Hoo! You are at the brink of some major decisions and it will be an emotional/ mental rollercoaster but it is oh so worth it - there is light at the end of the tunnel... The Scotsman
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The Watchtower hates Scotsmen
by kurtbethel inbecause i have carefully looked over every picture and representation i can find of the so called paradise earth published in the last 30 years.
there are people in all sorts of clothing from many cultures, american casual, african, asian, hispanic, and others.. but i have not seen a single image that shows you kilt wearers will make it into the new systemtm!.
does that make you so angry that your sporran stands on edge?.
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The Scotsman
Its a valid point - I am writing a short letter of complaint at this very moment - goes as follows -
Hey GB
Gonnae gee us a brek and huv a kilt shuvved intae wan a yer paradise pictures. If yae dinnae dae this am gonnae chuck yer pamflets intae the wheelie bin.
p.s. - Whit is aw that 1914 mince on aboot?
English Translation -
Dear Governing Body
Could I please request that a kilt be inserted into one of your paradise pictures. If you do not do this I will have no choice but to throw your literature in the bin.
p.s. - Could someone please explain the 1914 doctrine to me?
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I'm new, let me introduce myself
by no lies please ini've been lurking here for many months.
i served as an elder for many years, and regular pioneer for much longer until recently.
i'm also a mts grad and was used extensively on the circuit and district level.
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The Scotsman
Welcome to the board. Well - I can relate to your situation very much. I went through a similar experience (as many here have). But we survived, it was not easy, but we came out the other side better people - and you will to. May God bless you.
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Man vs. God... Wall Street Journal article. "Evolution has indeed dealt a blow to the idea of a benign creator".
by whereami inyou know this article is going to be quoted in some watchtower rag as showing that religion is going to be eliminated soooon.. .
http://online.wsj.com/article/sb10001424052970203440104574405030643556324.html.
karen armstrong says we need god to grasp the wonder of our existence.
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The Scotsman
Oh God - not another pro evolution thread..........
Richard Dawkins is as fanatical as any religious leader - and he is qouted WAY to much....
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What do you think - are most ex-JWs atheist, agnostic, or still involved in some form of religion?
by lifelong humanist ini dad 6 years ago because, after a rational search came to the conclusion that there probably is no god.
shortly afterwards, i concluded that (for me) there is no god, which made me feel that i really was a natural-born humanist - a position that i'm entirely comfortable with.
i know that many former jws hold a similar, atheistic viewpoint.
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The Scotsman
My experience with the JWs certainly destroyed my faith in the WTBTS - but not my faith in God. I am in no hurry to affiliate myself with any religious group of any kind - I do not think I need to - but maybe some day I will. I wonder, of all those who leave high control groups like the JWs, how many become non-believers - I suspect quite a high percentage. As long as people are happy in there life they can believe anything they want to believe - each to there own... Missing Link said - Atheism is the obvious "truth". How can this be true? Can you prove God does "not" exist? If not - its not an ""obvious"" truth....
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Do You Believe In "God"?
by minimus ini know many people simply think that believing in a "god" is simply ridiculous.
i don't.
i can't necessarily "prove" that god cares, or that god exists but i'll tell you what---when something awful happens i do pray to god and hope for the best..
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The Scotsman
Absolutely YES, I believe in God!
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When will they realise that the bus isn't coming?
by eyeslice ini was still a kid and living at home at the time, and so that must have been well over 30 years ago, that i heard ron drage (now a senior member of the uk bethel) say "if you are waiting at the bus stop it, is better to be 10 minutes early rather than miss it".
what he was referring to of course was the then then 1975 issue; in other words armageddon has arrived yet but it just round the corner and we are a little early for it.. i don't know what brought this to my mind the other day but i got to thinking, surely if you are waiting for a bus and you get there 10 minutes early and it doesn't then turn up, how long do you wait?
10 minutes, 15 minutes, half an hour, an hour, two hours?
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The Scotsman
Most will wait until the day they die.
They think the bus is bringing them never ending life on a paradise earth - in there mind its worth the waiting.
It certainly was worth waiting for in my mind until -of course - I realised the bus was not coming.
Well, thats not quite right. I still think the bus is coming but it will come for all of us - but i am not waiting for it anymore.
It will turn up when its due.....